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	<title>Comments on: Should there be a Best Practice for censorship?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/</link>
	<description>Security Research, Computer Laboratory, University of Cambridge</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 12:18:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Dale Sundstrom</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22291</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale Sundstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22291</guid>
		<description>Censorship is NOT a Best Practice. It is impractical and ineffective--like trying to take pee out of a pool.

What needs to be developed is a &lt;em&gt;Best Practice for Responding to Objectionable Content.&lt;/em&gt;

This would help admins and governments everywhere, who sometimes mistakenly assume that censoring is a good way to respond. This Best Practice would provide guidance on the most appropriate and effective responses for various types of content and objections.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Censorship is NOT a Best Practice. It is impractical and ineffective&#8211;like trying to take pee out of a pool.</p>
<p>What needs to be developed is a <em>Best Practice for Responding to Objectionable Content.</em></p>
<p>This would help admins and governments everywhere, who sometimes mistakenly assume that censoring is a good way to respond. This Best Practice would provide guidance on the most appropriate and effective responses for various types of content and objections.</p>
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		<title>By: Adrienne</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22273</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrienne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 14:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22273</guid>
		<description>The second argument about encouraging something that may be unacheiveable does not seem to be a very strong objection. People don't stop working for world peace, though many people would argue that that might be unacheiveable.  I think your first reason, the ideological one, can and should stand on its own. Simply put, censorship, and keeping information away from people, should not be encouraged.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The second argument about encouraging something that may be unacheiveable does not seem to be a very strong objection. People don&#8217;t stop working for world peace, though many people would argue that that might be unacheiveable.  I think your first reason, the ideological one, can and should stand on its own. Simply put, censorship, and keeping information away from people, should not be encouraged.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Fong</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22268</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Fong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 04:02:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22268</guid>
		<description>&#62;&#62; it will reinforce the impression that censoring the Internet can actually be achieved

It's actually quite possible depending on what your standards are. There are plenty of governments content with censoring "subversive" content 90% of the time for 90% of the population, the logic being that dissidents aren't a problem until you have a critical mass of them.   This is especially true for apathetic populations.

You also have to consider that Internet censorship is not occurring in a vacuum. Social norms, other state restrictions, and propaganda are all at work as well. Depending on how those play out, an otherwise ineffective censorship regime may succeed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt; it will reinforce the impression that censoring the Internet can actually be achieved</p>
<p>It&#8217;s actually quite possible depending on what your standards are. There are plenty of governments content with censoring &#8220;subversive&#8221; content 90% of the time for 90% of the population, the logic being that dissidents aren&#8217;t a problem until you have a critical mass of them.   This is especially true for apathetic populations.</p>
<p>You also have to consider that Internet censorship is not occurring in a vacuum. Social norms, other state restrictions, and propaganda are all at work as well. Depending on how those play out, an otherwise ineffective censorship regime may succeed.</p>
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		<title>By: Clive Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22259</link>
		<dc:creator>Clive Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 11:32:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22259</guid>
		<description>Richard,

giafly indirectly raises a point, is blocking potentialy harmfull content (in order to protect resources etc) censorship in the accepted meaning of the word or self protection?

That point asside history shows that censorship eventually fails from the internal preasures of operating a system of ever increasing lies and half truths against the external supportable reality. 

The eventual result is frequently the demiese of the censoring organisation and it's replacment with one that is (for a while) more acceptable to the populace.

To date the longest running sensors are I belive the various organisations that deal with peoples faiths, where there is no question of provable truth or falsehood just belife. And even these organisations have a tendency to either die out with time or change their behaviour.

So the question should be "why build a framework for something that is destined to impload"?

I can only assume that the proposers belive there is some short term gain to be made, and that is what should be rooted out and robustly dealt with.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard,</p>
<p>giafly indirectly raises a point, is blocking potentialy harmfull content (in order to protect resources etc) censorship in the accepted meaning of the word or self protection?</p>
<p>That point asside history shows that censorship eventually fails from the internal preasures of operating a system of ever increasing lies and half truths against the external supportable reality. </p>
<p>The eventual result is frequently the demiese of the censoring organisation and it&#8217;s replacment with one that is (for a while) more acceptable to the populace.</p>
<p>To date the longest running sensors are I belive the various organisations that deal with peoples faiths, where there is no question of provable truth or falsehood just belife. And even these organisations have a tendency to either die out with time or change their behaviour.</p>
<p>So the question should be &#8220;why build a framework for something that is destined to impload&#8221;?</p>
<p>I can only assume that the proposers belive there is some short term gain to be made, and that is what should be rooted out and robustly dealt with.</p>
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		<title>By: anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22244</link>
		<dc:creator>anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jun 2007 23:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22244</guid>
		<description>It is a very interesting and timely article.

Chavez has just shut down RCTV, the oldest TV station is Venezuela.

One week before, he took over on CANTV, the national phone company, which also owns the Internet back-bone

CANTV did block key websites, taking them out from their DNS servers.

The answer to all of this ?

People began to offer links to free / external DNS servers

RCTV began to post their newscasts in youtube 
Check:
a) http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070601-the-counter-revolution-wont-be-televised-but-it-will-be-on-youtube.html
b) http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=elobservadorenlinea

And TV stations in Colombia began to broadcast the newscasts from Colombia to Venezuela

Needless to say, SMS textings, blogs, etc have pictures, stories, etc</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is a very interesting and timely article.</p>
<p>Chavez has just shut down RCTV, the oldest TV station is Venezuela.</p>
<p>One week before, he took over on CANTV, the national phone company, which also owns the Internet back-bone</p>
<p>CANTV did block key websites, taking them out from their DNS servers.</p>
<p>The answer to all of this ?</p>
<p>People began to offer links to free / external DNS servers</p>
<p>RCTV began to post their newscasts in youtube<br />
Check:<br />
a) <a href="http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070601-the-counter-revolution-wont-be-televised-but-it-will-be-on-youtube.html" rel="nofollow">http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070601-the-counter-revolution-wont-be-televised-but-it-will-be-on-youtube.html</a><br />
b) <a href="http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=elobservadorenlinea" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=elobservadorenlinea</a></p>
<p>And TV stations in Colombia began to broadcast the newscasts from Colombia to Venezuela</p>
<p>Needless to say, SMS textings, blogs, etc have pictures, stories, etc</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Clayton</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22229</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Clayton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Jun 2007 12:23:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22229</guid>
		<description>Pop-up blockers don't prevent those pretty JavaScript floating ads so beloved of the national newspaer sites; disabling Flash will stop Flash, but not other technologies; and anyone who uses a spam filter knows full well that a fair amount of junk still gets through.

So, no, I don't think any of these technologies works, except in so far as if you switch off your computer then you can't access the Internet at all...  hang, but that's my mobile phone beeping because its download has finished...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pop-up blockers don&#8217;t prevent those pretty JavaScript floating ads so beloved of the national newspaer sites; disabling Flash will stop Flash, but not other technologies; and anyone who uses a spam filter knows full well that a fair amount of junk still gets through.</p>
<p>So, no, I don&#8217;t think any of these technologies works, except in so far as if you switch off your computer then you can&#8217;t access the Internet at all&#8230;  hang, but that&#8217;s my mobile phone beeping because its download has finished&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: giafly</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22228</link>
		<dc:creator>giafly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Jun 2007 11:33:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22228</guid>
		<description>Re: The second, and I think the most telling, objection is that it will reinforce the impression that censoring the Internet can actually be achieved! whereas the evidence piles up that it just isn’t possible.

I disagree. Anyone who uses a popup blocker, disables Flash, or uses a spam filter knows that the Internet can be censored and this can work well.

The real technical issue is that filters don't scale - as the audience protected by centralised filtering grows then you inevitably get more over-blocking because anything that offends anyone gets banned.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: The second, and I think the most telling, objection is that it will reinforce the impression that censoring the Internet can actually be achieved! whereas the evidence piles up that it just isn’t possible.</p>
<p>I disagree. Anyone who uses a popup blocker, disables Flash, or uses a spam filter knows that the Internet can be censored and this can work well.</p>
<p>The real technical issue is that filters don&#8217;t scale - as the audience protected by centralised filtering grows then you inevitably get more over-blocking because anything that offends anyone gets banned.</p>
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		<title>By: D. M. Witt</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22223</link>
		<dc:creator>D. M. Witt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2007 21:59:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/05/31/should-there-be-a-best-practice-for-censorship/#comment-22223</guid>
		<description>Why would a BCP not convert the wicked in to ignorant?  They could be proud of their fig-leaf that doesn't work.

Note - I think a BCP is a bad idea because it endorses a wicked practice.  That should be sufficient motive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why would a BCP not convert the wicked in to ignorant?  They could be proud of their fig-leaf that doesn&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>Note - I think a BCP is a bad idea because it endorses a wicked practice.  That should be sufficient motive.</p>
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