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	<title>Comments on: Debug mode = hacking tool?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/</link>
	<description>Security Research, Computer Laboratory, University of Cambridge</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 18:43:15 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Clive Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21772</link>
		<dc:creator>Clive Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 18:20:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21772</guid>
		<description>Arik,

&quot;f you switch away from your clear-text protocol you cover both attack vectors and then some.&quot;

Ouch, there is nothing particularly wrong with clear text protocols, and a heck of a lot right with them. It is one of the reasons why they are so prevalent on the Internet.

The real problem is securing sensitive information and using appropriate security mechanisums where required.

For instance a clear text protocol that has &quot;PSWD=XX...XX&quot; is not insecure if XX...XX is secure and not reusable (think encrypted with a One Time Pad for simplicity of explination).

All a debug mode should do is assist in resolving protocol issues, therfor any error message should be appropriate for debuging (ie &quot;Host not found&quot;) and not for leaking information (ie &quot;Password incorrect&quot;).

If (and only if) the communications protocol is secure and both the host and client are authenticated with respect to each other should security related information be given by either side to the other.

The problems most designers have is trying to decide what is appropriate for protocol debuging and what actually leakes information, and at what stage it is appropriate to release information of any kind. Unfortunatly the usual result is either no information or all information in all contexts neither of which is particularly helpfull in practice.

The fly in the ointment as far as security is concerned is &quot;unknown attacks&quot; in that information that is assumed safe to give, might under a new attack (unknown at design time) leak usefull information to the attacker. Even this if you give it some though can be mitigated against to a very great extent. 

Some methods of attack are believed to be dificult to mitigate agains such as Denial Of Service, under these conditions minimal information transfer and minimal load on the host are usualy considered the desirable design conditions. Therefore generaly the design choice is no debugging information or response as this would appear to minimise the atack potential. However again careful though shows that there are ways to minimise the attack potential and still provide debug information at a level that alows protocol issues to be resolved.

Poor design considerations are not a good reason to remove a useful diagnostic tool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arik,</p>
<p>&#8220;f you switch away from your clear-text protocol you cover both attack vectors and then some.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ouch, there is nothing particularly wrong with clear text protocols, and a heck of a lot right with them. It is one of the reasons why they are so prevalent on the Internet.</p>
<p>The real problem is securing sensitive information and using appropriate security mechanisums where required.</p>
<p>For instance a clear text protocol that has &#8220;PSWD=XX&#8230;XX&#8221; is not insecure if XX&#8230;XX is secure and not reusable (think encrypted with a One Time Pad for simplicity of explination).</p>
<p>All a debug mode should do is assist in resolving protocol issues, therfor any error message should be appropriate for debuging (ie &#8220;Host not found&#8221;) and not for leaking information (ie &#8220;Password incorrect&#8221;).</p>
<p>If (and only if) the communications protocol is secure and both the host and client are authenticated with respect to each other should security related information be given by either side to the other.</p>
<p>The problems most designers have is trying to decide what is appropriate for protocol debuging and what actually leakes information, and at what stage it is appropriate to release information of any kind. Unfortunatly the usual result is either no information or all information in all contexts neither of which is particularly helpfull in practice.</p>
<p>The fly in the ointment as far as security is concerned is &#8220;unknown attacks&#8221; in that information that is assumed safe to give, might under a new attack (unknown at design time) leak usefull information to the attacker. Even this if you give it some though can be mitigated against to a very great extent. </p>
<p>Some methods of attack are believed to be dificult to mitigate agains such as Denial Of Service, under these conditions minimal information transfer and minimal load on the host are usualy considered the desirable design conditions. Therefore generaly the design choice is no debugging information or response as this would appear to minimise the atack potential. However again careful though shows that there are ways to minimise the attack potential and still provide debug information at a level that alows protocol issues to be resolved.</p>
<p>Poor design considerations are not a good reason to remove a useful diagnostic tool.</p>
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		<title>By: Arik</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21588</link>
		<dc:creator>Arik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Apr 2007 06:50:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21588</guid>
		<description>Dan,

I think that concentrating on the device having more feature takes away from the real problem - that the protocol has a vulnerability. I know it&#039;s a controversial subject, and I hold the opinion that the chip should let you do whatever you want. It is not up to the chip mfg to cover up for a design error.

If that rational holds, you might argue that having the ability to switch an Ethernet device to promiscuous mode should only be allowed on registered hardware devices because it can compromise the security of the network. While I agree that yes, a scarcity of promisc-capable Ethernet devices will probably prevent some people from sniffing sensitive information of the network, this is side-stepping the real problem - that there are clear-text credentials running on the network. While increasing the price of an attack, the attack is still very much possible. If you switch away from your clear-text protocol you cover both attack vectors and then some.

I hope the analogy is clear,

-- Arik</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan,</p>
<p>I think that concentrating on the device having more feature takes away from the real problem &#8211; that the protocol has a vulnerability. I know it&#8217;s a controversial subject, and I hold the opinion that the chip should let you do whatever you want. It is not up to the chip mfg to cover up for a design error.</p>
<p>If that rational holds, you might argue that having the ability to switch an Ethernet device to promiscuous mode should only be allowed on registered hardware devices because it can compromise the security of the network. While I agree that yes, a scarcity of promisc-capable Ethernet devices will probably prevent some people from sniffing sensitive information of the network, this is side-stepping the real problem &#8211; that there are clear-text credentials running on the network. While increasing the price of an attack, the attack is still very much possible. If you switch away from your clear-text protocol you cover both attack vectors and then some.</p>
<p>I hope the analogy is clear,</p>
<p>&#8211; Arik</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Cvrcek</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21585</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Cvrcek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 21:35:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21585</guid>
		<description>Arik,

there is THE question mark in the title;-) Absolutely, debug mode is useful in many scenarios. I just got the impression that vendors should  pay a bit more attention to how it is being used. I do not have any definitive answer. It is just my experience that it is much easier to perform the attack when you have got access to error code texts (when analyzing some source code) or non-standard modes of operation (like debug mode) when a special hardware is used in non-standard applications.

What I really do not know is how bad a debug mode is from the security point of view and how it should be allowed to be used.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arik,</p>
<p>there is THE question mark in the title;-) Absolutely, debug mode is useful in many scenarios. I just got the impression that vendors should  pay a bit more attention to how it is being used. I do not have any definitive answer. It is just my experience that it is much easier to perform the attack when you have got access to error code texts (when analyzing some source code) or non-standard modes of operation (like debug mode) when a special hardware is used in non-standard applications.</p>
<p>What I really do not know is how bad a debug mode is from the security point of view and how it should be allowed to be used.</p>
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		<title>By: Arik</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21572</link>
		<dc:creator>Arik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 06:01:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21572</guid>
		<description>Dan,

The (somewhat provocative) title of your excellent post is &quot;Debug mode = hacking tool&quot;. I understand what you&#039;re trying to say, but please say it the way it is - &quot;Debug mode simplifies implementing a cheap hacking tool&quot;. Saying it like you did implies that that debug mode is somehow wrong or is a feature that shouldn&#039;t exist, given current interpretation of the term &quot;hacking tool&quot;.

-- Arik</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan,</p>
<p>The (somewhat provocative) title of your excellent post is &#8220;Debug mode = hacking tool&#8221;. I understand what you&#8217;re trying to say, but please say it the way it is &#8211; &#8220;Debug mode simplifies implementing a cheap hacking tool&#8221;. Saying it like you did implies that that debug mode is somehow wrong or is a feature that shouldn&#8217;t exist, given current interpretation of the term &#8220;hacking tool&#8221;.</p>
<p>&#8211; Arik</p>
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		<title>By: JR</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21563</link>
		<dc:creator>JR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 13:02:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21563</guid>
		<description>This raises an interesting subject: Many &lt;em&gt;software&lt;/em&gt; products have problem determination and debugging facilities hidden in them, which may be activated by &quot;open sesame&quot; incantations of some sort, and probably could be used for attackes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This raises an interesting subject: Many <em>software</em> products have problem determination and debugging facilities hidden in them, which may be activated by &#8220;open sesame&#8221; incantations of some sort, and probably could be used for attackes.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Cvrcek</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21557</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Cvrcek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 05:50:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21557</guid>
		<description>to Arik

what you say about making the attack easier is exactly the point I wanted to make. One does not have to search for the right chips and design own device, nor solder anything. Hacker just buys off-the-shelf product and spends some time reprogramming functionality. Many more people are able to do this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to Arik</p>
<p>what you say about making the attack easier is exactly the point I wanted to make. One does not have to search for the right chips and design own device, nor solder anything. Hacker just buys off-the-shelf product and spends some time reprogramming functionality. Many more people are able to do this.</p>
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		<title>By: Clive Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21545</link>
		<dc:creator>Clive Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Apr 2007 12:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21545</guid>
		<description>As a general rule, debug modes are information rich to enable faults etc to be found (often giving unintended extra functionality).  Likewise security products have a history of being the oposit. 

It is part of the security by obscurity ethos that has in the past been prevelant in engineering thinking when presented with designing secure systems.

As has been shown many times any obscurity process is not real security as details will always leak or be found (Think the MicroSoft X-Box, Sky-Cards etc).

The only valid reason for not having debug modes perminantly enabled is resource issues. Be it functional / speed / real estate / pin usage etc.

There have been many occasions where I have designed products with low cost IC&#039;s where I have not used the chip in quite the way the manufacturer intended, this sideways design has in many cases saved a large cost and sometimes considerable PCB real estate.

Unfortunatly due to the nature of the way RF IC&#039;s etc are going (towards SDR) the oportunity for doing this as a hardware hack is diminishing whilst makeing software hacks (via firmware) much more rewarding.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a general rule, debug modes are information rich to enable faults etc to be found (often giving unintended extra functionality).  Likewise security products have a history of being the oposit. </p>
<p>It is part of the security by obscurity ethos that has in the past been prevelant in engineering thinking when presented with designing secure systems.</p>
<p>As has been shown many times any obscurity process is not real security as details will always leak or be found (Think the MicroSoft X-Box, Sky-Cards etc).</p>
<p>The only valid reason for not having debug modes perminantly enabled is resource issues. Be it functional / speed / real estate / pin usage etc.</p>
<p>There have been many occasions where I have designed products with low cost IC&#8217;s where I have not used the chip in quite the way the manufacturer intended, this sideways design has in many cases saved a large cost and sometimes considerable PCB real estate.</p>
<p>Unfortunatly due to the nature of the way RF IC&#8217;s etc are going (towards SDR) the oportunity for doing this as a hardware hack is diminishing whilst makeing software hacks (via firmware) much more rewarding.</p>
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		<title>By: Arik</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21539</link>
		<dc:creator>Arik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Apr 2007 01:21:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21539</guid>
		<description>Hello

In the particular example mentioned, the &quot;debug mode&quot; did not enable an attack, and its lack would not have prevented the attack. The only help it gives you is that it let you use the stock ZigBee chip rather than build your own. If the protocol is open, it doesn&#039;t weaken the security that one particular chipset gives you access to information that it shouldn&#039;t have - because you could have gotten the same information by building your own decoder. It only made the attack easier (hence cheaper).

I think the reason the chipset makers labeled it &#039;debug/eval&#039; is because of performance issues that can be created by increasing the rate of interrupts generated by the chip.

-- Arik</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello</p>
<p>In the particular example mentioned, the &#8220;debug mode&#8221; did not enable an attack, and its lack would not have prevented the attack. The only help it gives you is that it let you use the stock ZigBee chip rather than build your own. If the protocol is open, it doesn&#8217;t weaken the security that one particular chipset gives you access to information that it shouldn&#8217;t have &#8211; because you could have gotten the same information by building your own decoder. It only made the attack easier (hence cheaper).</p>
<p>I think the reason the chipset makers labeled it &#8216;debug/eval&#8217; is because of performance issues that can be created by increasing the rate of interrupts generated by the chip.</p>
<p>&#8211; Arik</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Parker</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21538</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Parker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Apr 2007 22:25:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21538</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s a &quot;debug mode&quot; on NetGear 834GT routers, which will enable utelnetd... Sky.com&#039;s broadband ISP uses a slightly-hardened version, which can still be easily made to exhibit the flaw^H^H^H^H feature, see http://steve-parker.org/urandom/?y=2007&amp;m=2#netgear

I told Sky about it two months ago; they do not seem to be interested that a simple phishing attack could open up anything on the router</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a &#8220;debug mode&#8221; on NetGear 834GT routers, which will enable utelnetd&#8230; Sky.com&#8217;s broadband ISP uses a slightly-hardened version, which can still be easily made to exhibit the flaw^H^H^H^H feature, see <a href="http://steve-parker.org/urandom/?y=2007&amp;m=2#netgear" rel="nofollow">http://steve-parker.org/urandom/?y=2007&amp;m=2#netgear</a></p>
<p>I told Sky about it two months ago; they do not seem to be interested that a simple phishing attack could open up anything on the router</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/comment-page-1/#comment-21537</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2007/04/16/debug-mode-hacking-tool/#comment-21537</guid>
		<description>All chips at least have a test facility. The manufacturer has to sort working from broken chips; this must be done efficiently because time spent in an automated tester is surprisingly expensive (it adds noticeably to the cost especially of cheaper chips). There&#039;s no obvious reason why test inputs couldn&#039;t be disabled by an on-chip fuse, though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All chips at least have a test facility. The manufacturer has to sort working from broken chips; this must be done efficiently because time spent in an automated tester is surprisingly expensive (it adds noticeably to the cost especially of cheaper chips). There&#8217;s no obvious reason why test inputs couldn&#8217;t be disabled by an on-chip fuse, though.</p>
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